Wednesday, June 22, 2011

Do Abortion Advocates Really Care About Women's Safety?

An article on Think Progress blog leaves me wondering if abortion advocates really care about the safety of women.

Last month, Republican lawmakers successfully passed an anti-choice bill requiring the state’s only three abortion clinics to be inspected twice a year, including one unannounced review. Under the new licensing standards, the Kansas Department of Health and Environment will create new standards for exits, lighting, bathrooms, and equipment and would have “the power to fine clinics” or “got to court to shut them down.” The law specifically targets abortion clinics and left other surgical clinics untouched by the new requirements — a fact that moved state Senate Majority Leader Jay Emler (R) to note the hypocrisy and vote against his party. However, the law passed in May and demands compliance by July 1.

While I can understand (I do not agree) that pro-aborts are feeling singled out, I cannot understand why they wouldn't want abortion clinics to be regulated like every other outpatient surgery center should be regulated.  Adequate exits are not only necessary for fire safety, but in the case of any outpatient surgery clinic, the exit must be able to accommodate gurneys that may need to be brought in (and out) during emergencies.

If Kansas’ law succeeds in shutting down the state’s abortion clinics, that would be nothing less that a direct attack on the Constitution. In Planned Parenthood v. Casey, the Supreme Court held that states may enact some abortion regulations, but they may not “strike at the right itself” to terminate a pregnancy. A law specifically designed to make it impossible to operate abortion clinics is a direct attack on women’s constitutional right to choose.

The state and federal government's role is supposed to be to protect it's citizens.  If an abortion clinic is not operating in a manner that guarantees the safety of it's patients, then it should be shut down.  As long as the clinics comply with Kansas state regulations, the state can NOT shut them down. Simple enough?

the law is also going to cost Kansas taxpayers an “absurd” amount of money: $67,000 a year to do six inspections at three clinics.

Yes, that is an absurd amount of money. 18 inspections @ $3700+ each = BIG Government over spending. 

In the end, it seems that rather than force abortion clinics to update their facilities and equipment, abortion advocates are willing to risk women's lives by fighting to keep them substandard.  I thought they didn't want to go back to the 'back-alley' abortion days, but it seems they do.  Maybe it's nostalgia.

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32 comments:

  1. The abortion lobby protected Gosnell for 30 years. Whenever a woman is wounded or killed by abortion, 'feminist' women's groups go silent. But operate a CPC that doesn't do abortions at all, and they'll shriek all day about how regulated they should be. Because everyone knows giving a woman free diapers is far more dangerous than jamming sharp instruments into the womb in order to kill a living human being. Women who die due to negligent quacks are just collateral damage to proaborts-you'll get the standard pat answer here 'gee that's too bad but no reason to make it illegal.' They couldn't care less about women, their record speaks for itself. Prochoice is happy to get you through the doors of the abortion mill-after that, you're on your own.

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  2. While I can understand (I do not agree) that pro-aborts are feeling singled out, I cannot understand why they wouldn't want abortion clinics to be regulated like every other outpatient surgery center should be regulated.

    Because they are not being regulated like every other outpatient surgery center should be regulated. Obviously, the standards exist for them alone and have absolutely nothing to do with women's health, any more than previous anti-abortion laws that regulated the type of drinking fountains available in abortion clinics had anything to do with the health of women.

    Now, if you can tell me what the size of janitor's closets has to do with the health of women seeking abortions, how this is vitally necessary to other forms of outpatient surgery (but apparently not important enough to enforce on plastic surgeons, dental surgeons, etc.), and why it's so important to enforce compliance on this vital issue that they couldn't wait for a few months to allow them to remodel, then I won't happen to assume that this is yet another cynical and dishonest bit of posturing on your part.

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  3. Armored Saint - Yes, what I heard from pro-aborts after Gosnell was closed down, was that somehow it was OUR fault. Of course everything else is our fault too. They do and say what they know. Place blame, rather than taking responsibility for themselves.

    CPC's dangerous? I haven't seen photos of an ambulance at a CPC. Have you?

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  4. Null - From your link:

    "These restrictions can include: width of hallways, jet and angle type of drinking fountains, the heights of ceilings, and how long one must wait between initially seeing the doctor and when the procedure can be performed."

    Width of hallways - refer to the post, same argument as exits.

    Jet and angle type of drinking fountains - Handicap accessibility. You wouldn't discriminate against handicapped people would you? Of course you would.

    Heights of ceilings - No clue what the intention is for this one. Safety? Lighting?

    Waiting periods - To give the woman extra time, in hopes that she changes her mind before doing something she will never be able to undo.

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  5. I was expecting something slimy and despicable from you, and I wasn't disappointed, but I must admit that even in my worst assessment of your moral character that I wasn't expecting you to hide behind the disabled as a means of prosecuting your anti-woman vendetta.

    Of course, the one commonality for everything in your response is that you—like the Kansas legislature—did not demonstrate that any of these new regulations were necessary nor why they should single out abortion clinics.

    Do you want me to tell you why they did that? Because they didn't want to take the chance of inadvertently making it impossible for other outpatient surgeries, like dental surgeries or plastic surgeries, to be performed in Kansas. But that is exactly what they want to do in the case of abortion procedures, and it's the only reason why you agree with them. So let's stop the little pantomime of being oh-so-concerned about women's health that you have to ban the very places that might save them when complications from pregnancy arise.

    Love your little bit on waiting periods, too. Oh, those poor dears cannot be trusted to understand that abortion is something "she will never be able to undo", so we must give in to the full flow of our patriarchal patronization and 'help' her come to the right decision.

    In fact, the waiting periods are to make it difficult for poor women to seek an abortion, which often (thanks to your crowd and their murderous thugs) requires traveling hundreds of miles for the procedure, and now you've added the extra complication of forcing her to stay the night, or even a week, before being able to exercise her own reproductive choices. But when the fetuses are born, you don't give a damn about their lives, because any attempt to ameliorate the poverty that these children are born into is just an "entitlement".

    You sicken me.

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  6. Women's clinics are singled out. You know that and I know that so stop with the oh-we-only-care-about-the-women crap, please.

    I guess the reasoning is pro-lifers can bomb every clinic or assassinate every doctor, so lets regulate water fountains and dimensions of a counseling room.

    BTW, nice picture. Will you post the one of Gerri Santoro with the title "This Is What We Stand For!" The good ol'days of dying alone and scared in a hotel room.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Exposure_photograph_5.jpg

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  7. I mean, pro-lifers can't bomb every clinic.......

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  8. Null - Dismembering fetuses is despicable.

    >>> That is all <<<

    Jackie - Let's get real here. Women's clinics are where abortion is performed. If the regulations make it more difficult for a woman to kill her fetus, then the fetus has a better chance of survival.

    Gerri Santoro had a choice, didn't she? The choice not to attempt an abortion. I'm not willing to sacrifice even 1 more human fetus, just because a woman 'might' go off the deep end.

    Abortion is a band-aid covering a social disease. Seems to me pro-choicers should be trying to fix the problems that cause women to take desparate measures such as abortion. But no, you and other choicers are too busy trying to protect your legal right to kill your babies.

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  9. LMAO at your high-handed hypocrisy in proclaiming that "abortion is a band-aid covering a social disease", when you've previously shown nothing but hostility to ameliorating the socioeconomic factors that make women need abortions in the first place. Instead, you dismiss such attempts as "entitlements". Apparently women are to feed and clothe their unwanted children with the anti-choicers' reserves of sanctimony (which admittedly are endless).

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  10. Null - Women don't *need* abortions, they want them. Why? They want to further their education and/or their careers. Why be strapped down with a baby when you can kill it in utero? Sex without consequences.

    Abortion IS a bandaid on a social disease.

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    Replies
    1. So they shouldn’t be allowed to further their educations or careers? You think women should spend all day in the kitchen?

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  11. "If the regulations make it more difficult for a woman to kill her fetus, then the fetus has a better chance of survival. "

    So you admit it. Your post suggest that it is prochoice who do not care about women's safety. But you've just admitted that its prolife that doesn't. Its all about preventing someone from exercising their constitutional right because you don't believe in it.

    "Gerri Santoro had a choice, didn't she?"

    Not in her eyes she didn't. But I guess you have a right to judge her because thats so Christian.

    "I'm not willing to sacrifice even 1 more human fetus, just because a woman 'might' go off the deep end. "

    Again another glaring example of how this is not about life because if someone is prolife (in the true sense of the word) you're pro all life. And YOU"RE not sacrificing anything. This isn't about you. You are not the representative of all women.

    "Seems to me pro-choicers should be trying to fix the problems that cause women to take desparate measures such as abortion."

    We do. You don't. And you are constantly slut-shaming against women who have sex, as you would say, "without consequences." NOW for example has been working for years to get equal pay for equal work, affordable daycare and healthcare, etc. What exactly has your side done besides kill people and bomb clinics and harass women?

    In addition, please explain to my why I, a Jew (a religion that supports a right to choose), should follow your Christian beliefs? Who made you the appointed moral guardian?

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  12. Jackie - "Your post suggest that it is prochoice who do not care about women's safety." But it you who condones promiscuous sex, with the risk of STD's, pregnancy, and promotes abortion which can be dangerous for women, and is always deadly for their fetus. It's you, not me.

    Gerri Santoro is a tragic case, used to support your abortion agenda. When I think of Gerri, I think of the multitude of abused women, who have LEGAL abortions, and go right back to their abusive relationship. And with Gerri, pro-choice would have put her right back in the arms of her abusive husband. Pro-choice is always harping about saving children from abuse, by killing them first inutero. Forward that 28 yrs, and you have Gerri Santoro. God rest her soul.

    "And YOU"RE not sacrificing anything." Each of us has a responsibility to protect the innocent. If I stand by and watch a person (or a fetus) get killed, without trying to prevent it, then I am sacrificing them.

    "What exactly has your side done besides kill people and bomb clinics and harass women?" Treat them like people rather than weak little girls. CPC's provide help for women that want to keep their babies. They help with diaper's, clothing, food. They help women gain employment, and find a reasonable place to live. They support both women AND their children.

    What does pro-choice do for women who keep their babies? Nada

    You have your faith, I have mine. Fair enough? From what I understand about Jewish law regarding abortion, it should only be done if the mother's life is in danger. But then again, it depends on who your ask. http://www.slate.com/id/1005956/

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  13. The Jewish religion does not support abortion. Factions within the Jewish religion support abortion. Just like every religion I know of, including Catholicism, people will change the rules a little at a time. to suit their wants.

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  14. Again I ask you, if my religious beliefs condone abortion, who are you to deny me that right based off of your religious beliefs?

    "Treat them like people rather than weak little girls."

    But your side are the ones that put mandatory wait period on abortion because you think they need to think more about what they are doing like they are little girls. Women know what they are doing and know whats best for them. And CPCs trick women who are looking for an abortion or counseling into their clinic to spew Christian beliefs and guilt them into carrying the pregnancy. Trust me, there is plenty of evidence of that. They also tell lies about breast cancer links and so forth. You are liars. Isn't their something about bearing false witness in Christianity?

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  15. What I said is that Orthodox Jewish law is ANTI abortion. Your beliefs have been spawned by people making up their own rules, rather than following the rules as they were set in the first place.

    "Women know what they are doing and know whats best for them." All people make mistakes. Women are people, and people are influenced by others. The influence of 'sexual freedom', leads women to risking pregnancy. Then of course there's the influence of abortion advocates who support them in that risky lifestyle, and support them aborting the result of it. Hence, if women knew what they were doing, they wouldn't have gotten pregnant in the first place. Killing their young is not the answer to the social problem of sex and abortion. Not having sex is.

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  16. Number of prochoice groups promoting regulation of abortion clinics: 0
    Number of prochoice groups aiding women wounded by abortion: 0
    Number of prochoice charities aiding the families of women dead by safe legal abortion: 0
    Number of prochoice charities helping struggling single mothers feed their kids: 0
    Number of ineffective crap liberal social programs designed to tax the poor into deeper poverty in order to gain complete state control over the populace: all
    Number of bigmouthed unemployed liberal college students contributing tax dollars to fund welfare for the poor: 0
    Number of abortion clinics bombed today: 0
    Number of abortionists shot today: 0
    Number of unborn human beings killed by abortion today: 3700
    Number of abortions in the US since Roe V Wade passed: over 54 million

    Do the math, morons.

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  17. Armored Saint - Prochoice groups find it cheaper to abort women's babies. cheaper than helping them feed and clothe their kids, helping them to find a decent place to live, helping women find a job so they can take care of their families. That stuff is expensive! Good thing prolife charities and CPC's are there for them.

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  18. Prochoice groups find it cheaper to abort women's babies. cheaper than helping them feed and clothe their kids, helping them to find a decent place to live, helping women find a job so they can take care of their families. That stuff is expensive! Good thing prolife charities and CPC's are there for them.

    Really? Which CPCs help women find jobs, help them afford housing, and help them feed their children (given that most women who seek out an abortion have already given birth, this would have to include existing children)?

    Now, the CPCs do promise a few trinkets if you come and listen to a harangue about Jesus, but so far I've never heard of a single one that was doing serious and sustained charity work.

    To judge by your own response when I presented a multi-point plan about how to reduce the socioeconomic factors that lead to abortion, you don't seem all that interested in actually helping the lives of poor women. Nor is the wider anti-abortion movement all that concerned about poor women, since they've hitched their wagon to a party that is devoted to slashing assistance for poor people and increasing the gap between rich and poor. If the anti-choice movement were anything other than a notional extension of the Republican party, they would be a strong outside constituency that would be agitating for social justice and keeping both of the two major parties from conspiring to screw poor people. Instead, the only thing the anti-choice movement cares about instituting is theocracy.

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  19. TAAG- "What I said is that Orthodox Jewish law is ANTI abortion. Your beliefs have been spawned by people making up their own rules, rather than following the rules as they were set in the first place. "

    Again, I'll ask you if my religious beliefs condone abortion, who are you to deny me that right based off of your religious beliefs?

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  20. Jackie - What I'm saying is that the religious laws are changed to suit whomever follows that religion. Someday your particular brand of religion may condone killing newborns and toddlers. How far are you willing to let it go?

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  21. So you're saying my religion is bogus. Nice.

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  22. No Jackie, I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying your religion has changed the rules. But not any more than a lot of other religions though. We all see churches popping up in temporary rented buildings. Some of these churches have adapted rules to suit them.

    Do some research, find out for yourself.

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  23. " Do some research, find out for yourself."

    I know about my own religion, thank you.

    I know what you're trying to say (invalidate my religion) but the bottom line is I was raised in a more liberal sect and thats what I believe. So again, if my religious beliefs condone abortion, who are you to deny me that right based off of your religious beliefs?

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  24. Jackie "So you're saying my religion" and "I know what you're trying to say". Stop trying to put words in my mouth. That's not at all what I said. Also, I didn't bring religion into this discussion, you did.

    My job is to make you think, on a human level, not on a spiritual one. Human fetuses are dying by the millions. The majority of these deaths can be prevented. They are not just clumps of cells (any more than you and I are). They have heartbeats, arms and legs, fingers and toes, even fingerprints. Mouths that open, tongues they can stick out. They have developing digestive and circulatory systems. They are just very small, and easy to turn a blind eye to. Think about that for a minute.

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  25. First of all you refuse to directly answer my question. All you keep saying is that my religions was changed to suit people needs. Newsflash, religion is man-made and is constantly changing to suit the needs of people (or in reality, men). Thats why there's different sects of all religions, ranging from the most fundamentalist to the most liberal. You are a fundamentalist and are no different that the theocrats in Iran or El Salvador that make life miserable by imposing Draconian views of God you've never spoken to or seen and have no proof of actually existing.

    Second, nothing you have said is anything new to me nor is it something I have not thought about before. Even if you could convince me that that "clump of cells" is an actually human being, the bottom line is you could not convince me that that "human being" has a right to reside in my uterus against my will. You, and your buddies, have no right to say that the clump of cells is more important to the person carrying that clump of cells. Just like I can't force you to donate blood or put your life in danger via organ donation or the such to save my life. Why don't you think about that for a minute.

    But I know what your response will be. Unlike an organ donation or blood transfusion, a woman caused the pregnancy by having sex. Now you can pull the "personal responsibility" card but some women (for financial reasons, mental health, physical health, etc) feel an abortion is taking personal responsibility. Now I know thats something you cannot understand but its none of your business anyway. You are responsible for you. Other people's sex life and reproductive decisions are none of your business. I will never understand the obsession the religious right has with other people's sex life. Grow up and get a life.

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  26. Yes Jackie, I am a fundamentalist, and I'm proud of it too. Just as I may never convince you that a human fetus has the human right to reside whereever he/she implanted, you will never convince me that women should have the legal 'on-demand' right to kill them, simply because they can.

    "But I know what your response will be" Then why are you here if you know everything?

    Grow up? What a joke!

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